Vitamin D

[Onemorestep]

Just a reminder to take your vitamin D! Almost have the population is deficient in the US and it’s hard to be happy without  remember you need D + K2 at the same time for absorption and to make sure the calcium in your body goes into your bones and not your arteries. I use metagenics brand but there are plenty of others I’m sure are fine. 
 

https://www.amazon.com/Metagenics-D3-5000-120-Count/dp/B002D64I98

“Berridge conducted a study in 2017 which have evidenced that depression caused by an imbalance between excitatory and inhibitory pathways in the brain. Hypothesis argues that vitamin D reduces the increase in neuronal levels of calcium (CA +2) that are driving depression. Vitamin D plays a role in maintaining the expression of the CA 2+ pumps and buffers that reduce CA 2+ levels, which may explain how it acts to reduce the onset of depression [21].

In 2014, Gezen-AK et al. conducted a study which shows that vitamin D regulates the release of nerve growth factor (NGF), an essential molecule for the neuronal survival of hippocampal neurons as well as cortical neurons [22].

 

Di Somma et al., in a study, shows optimal levels of vitamin D in the bloodstream are necessary to preserve the neurological development and protect the adult brain [27]. Balanced dietary intake is a well-established lifestyle factor in maintaining cognition during ageing. A recent study shows that vitamin D helps in keeping cognitive function in older adults [28]. An interesting study conducted by Harrison et al. shows the association of vitamin D deficiency and the development of diabetes mellitus through paraventricular hypothalamic nuclei. It shows the positive relationships between them [29]. In November 2017, Kesby JP et al. conducted a study showing the effect of vitamin D on both widespread neurotransmitter changes (glutamine/noradrenaline) and regionally selective neurotransmitter changes (dopamine/serotonin). It concluded that developmental vitamin D deficiency leads to these brain changes [30-31]. Due to its effect on dopamine pathway in the brain, vitamin D can be a useful therapeutic agent used as an intervention therapy to be combined with existing treatments for Parkinson’s disease [32]. Staphylococcal enterotoxin B (SEB) is a superantigen and can initiate inflammation. Microglial cells in brain fight against these types of inflammation. Vitamin D deficiency affects the inflammatory process in the brain causing exposure of the brain to these vulnerable pathogens”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6132681/

Edited January 1, 2020 by Onemorestep

[VisualDude]

Good article.

A note about dosage.  The maximum daily dose long term is 4,000 iu without blood test monitoring.  [ Ref missing right now but that is for all adults worldwide ].  To put this in perspective, if you are in the sun a lot, the the skin will make up to 10,000 iu a day.

I post this because lots of articles about the danger of Vitamin D as well as many doctors feeling one only needs 200 iu/day.  If I find the ref I'll post it but one can be safe with the above dose indefinitely.  I am currently taking 10,000 iu for 3 years now (with blood tests).  Since am on multiple meds for osteoporosis, am utilizing a lot of D.

Thank you also for mentioning K2.  Bones need it (osteoblasts) to mature by mineralizing.  It is very effective at preventing plaque from calcifying as you mentioned.  Again doctors are scared of K, (1 and 2) because it interferes with blood thinners ... but again one usually shouldn't be on a blood thinner.

As for D helping HPPD, it would be interesting to see how many people it helps.  It doesn't do anything overt for me.  But its broad health benefits are respectable.  One should take it anyway.  If they can be tested, aim for mid to above mid range.  Long term minimum, even if in range, is inadvisable.

 

[new01]

@visualdude, what is the highest dose you have taking? 

Edited January 4, 2020 by new01

[VisualDude]

I've taken 15,000 iu / day for a couple weeks but decided to back down to 10k.

At 6 months of 10k/day, and prior to any osteoporosis meds, D3 (D 25-Hydroxy) was 82 and the active form (D 1,25 DIHY) was 62.  These are both roughly 80% into the range.

A couple years later with the meds Forteo and Prolia at the same time, D3 was 52 and the active form 72.  Forteo is a synthetic portion of parathyroid hormone (PTH).  Both work by stimulating the conversion of D3 to its active form.  Am told this happens in the bones and the kidneys.  But don't know about in the brain, although both forms cross the BBB.

While the D3 I take has K2, last spring found some high dose vitamin K1 and K2 and have been taking that  https://www.allergyresearchgroup.com/full-spectrum-vitamin-k-90-softgels

 

It seemed unnecessary to work with anything higher.  I may drop to 5,000 iu soon when finishing Forteo.  I make so much calcium oxalate that there is concern of causing kidney damage due to microcrystals (rather than stones).  This is uncertain but simple enough to drop dose for a few months then retest for stones  [ LabCorp has a urine test for stones called Litholink ].   I eat high protein which causes oxalate.  If I eat low protein, then don't feel as well, eat more carbs and feel even worse.  The whole thing may be the meds, D, or just me.  But I've always eaten lots of protein, fat and calcium since being a child.  Am 58 now and it ain't killed me yet, lol.

So this is what I've been doing and why.

[new01]

tnx for the reply. 

 

man i think you can go way higher. i was on 10,000 IU for a while and it didnt do anything for me as well, i am now on 50,000 IU/day and feel already much better after 1 week.

i know you're careful, but actually if you supplement for cofactors (yes for calcium overdose with k2 and others -magnesium, boron, beta-caroteen) you can take way more, blood levels are ok til 150 ng/ml for D3. 

but yes it is important to keep testing if you go this high for d3 levels and calcium levels. really should try it, hppd doesnt happen in countries close to the equator so that says i think a lot about the sun/d3 connection. 

check out my first post i did in this forum, has more information on it. but i would i say, defenitly give it a try, 10,000 IU is really nothing (equivalent of 15 mins sun).

 

 

[Onemorestep]

Definitely do not want to overdue it! I find if I do a dose of 20,000 every week or so I’m fine. Or max 5,000 a day. I may be able to/need to take more though because I have a VDR mutation. 
 

I mainly posted this because I, like many Americans, do not get enough sunlight. I started to exhibit some pretty intense D deficiency symptoms very rapidly a few weeks ago. Extreme depression, anxiety, lethargy, orthostatic hypertension, shortness of breath you name it. 20,000 units of D later I felt like a human again. 
 

I do get bit by seasonal depression every winter no matter what. It’s never gotten this bad before though.... 

 

might have something to do with the 300,000mcg of methyl b12 I took one day  

[new01]

So what research are you basing that on? Really if you look into it, it is really big farma who tries to keep us from.taking more.

Also i think this could be a treatmwnt that can work for our group, so we should not dismiss it too easily based on some opinions we have formed that i can be toxic when it is not easily toxic

[VisualDude]

12 hours ago, new01 said:

hppd doesnt happen in countries close to the equator so that says i think a lot about the sun/d3 connection.

Would like to see data on that one

 

[VisualDude]

2 hours ago, new01 said:

So what research are you basing that on? Really if you look into it, it is really big farma who tries to keep us from.taking more.

Also i think this could be a treatmwnt that can work for our group, so we should not dismiss it too easily based on some opinions we have formed that i can be toxic when it is not easily toxic

Not everything wrong is a conspiracy.  Habits too can be hard to break.  This study indicates the old suggested dosage being 400-600 IU/day was based on preventing rickets.  This study also puts the normal daily dose "around 8000 IU for young adults and thereafter" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5541280/pdf/jpmph-50-4-278.pdf

Because D toxicity can be nasty and take 6 months for levels to drop to normal, one needs to monitor high dosage taken long term.  D absorbs in adipose so heavy people may not show good serum blood levels for some time ... then if they start losing weight (especially quickly) their serum reaches toxic levels with its consequences.  K2 does prevent bone loss which happens with excessive D but one can't count on it being a fix for taking too much.

Now if very high doses has cured you HPPD, great!  How many months have you been taking 50,000 iu a day for?  Or has it just been one week?  You also said earlier that "most of the symptons have been solved/restored on there own" ... so what does D do for you specifically?

[Fawkinchit]

6 hours ago, VisualDude said:

Would like to see data on that one

 

Lmao yah I would like to see this study as well. Looks like he edited that comment out?

[Fawkinchit]

On 1/1/2020 at 12:24 AM, Onemorestep said:

Di Somma et al., in a study, shows optimal levels of vitamin D in the bloodstream are necessary to preserve the neurological development and protect the adult brain [27]. Balanced dietary intake is a well-established lifestyle factor in maintaining cognition during ageing. A recent study shows that vitamin D helps in keeping cognitive function in older adults [28]. An interesting study conducted by Harrison et al. shows the association of vitamin D deficiency and the development of diabetes mellitus through paraventricular hypothalamic nuclei. It shows the positive relationships between them [29]. In November 2017, Kesby JP et al. conducted a study showing the effect of vitamin D on both widespread neurotransmitter changes (glutamine/noradrenaline) and regionally selective neurotransmitter changes (dopamine/serotonin). It concluded that developmental vitamin D deficiency leads to these brain changes [30-31]. Due to its effect on dopamine pathway in the brain, vitamin D can be a useful therapeutic agent used as an intervention therapy to be combined with existing treatments for Parkinson’s disease [32]. Staphylococcal enterotoxin B (SEB) is a superantigen and can initiate inflammation. Microglial cells in brain fight against these types of inflammation. Vitamin D deficiency affects the inflammatory process in the brain causing exposure of the brain to these vulnerable pathogens”

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6132681/

That is interesting, thanks for sharing.

[new01]

Here my reply on your comments.

if you want to know where i am coming from read my recent post on vitamin D :

 

answers: 

hppd equator connection

ok i am sorry i cant find the article, i read it about it a while ago, but cant find it. so i know bad but i cant substantiate that.  it would be in line though with other studies which show this connection with occurence of other diseases around the equator (depression, diabetes type 1, cancer, ms, etc. almost don't occur here), but you are right cant find it for hppd so wont build on that further then. 

claim above with research: https://jefftbowles.com/vitamin-d3-deficiency-causes-most-human-disease/

 

vitamin d conspiracy / against interest pharma

yes i think it is likely that pharmaceutical companies might try to downplay the use of certain supplement if they threaten their interest, is that so far out to think. you can call it a 'conspiracy', well it is just human nature to protect what is yours there are so many cases of companies acting out of their interest and by that harming the public, just look this up for example: https://www.autonews.com/article/20030616/SUB/306160770/lee-iacocca-s-pinto-a-fiery-failure

for this specific case read this story:

vitamin d vs pharma.pdf

it might be a case of protecting interest or not, but I think it is defineatly possible there are underrated supplements in curing disease. for more information on how vitamin d can cure diseases read these books, they have lots of cited studies in them as well.:

-The Miraculous Results

-The cure and prevention of all diseases

 

hppd and habits

don't know why you bring up habits but, in the end it is about the body recovering from disease, if you want to help your body (excerise, taking supplements) yes that might help, but it is not a question of willpower/willing yourself into healing (at least in my experience) more of recovery and time which, yes, can require some health activities. 

 

toxicity

there have been many studies going far back on toxicity and most studies find that:

a) vitamin D3 is not toxic (d2 or vitamin 3 made by impure production methods is) as it is hypothised now. 

b) what can be dangerous as studies found is: high vitamin d2 levels, too much calcium and magnesium in your blood (hypercalcemia, hypermagnesia) because d3 eats up vitamin k2, magnesium, boron and vitamin a - supplement for this. testing blood levels opf calcium and supplementation can prevent these problems, although probability is not that high. 

c) going to vitamin levels as high 150 ng/ml is a safe limit determined by research if you are scared about toxicity, almost everybody has blood levels lower than this ( a lot of people even lower than 50 ng/ml). and these higher d3 blood levels this high can be very therapeutic for a many, many diseases (see link from first point). 

 

articles below: (much more information can be found in the books i mentioned with has a lot of cited research on toxicity and therapeutic effects)

 

vitamin d levels and weight  & testing d3

yes weight loss affects your vitamin d levels, however toxicity is very rare and can be contributed to other factors (see points above). 

yes it is important to test blood levels for high vitamin d3 (and supplement k2, magnesium, boron, beta-caroteen) 

 

my usage & benefits/personal results

i did a while back 10,000 iu for a while and it didnt do much. then i read the book about high dosing for and tried 20,000 iu for two weeks which helped a bit. with 50,000 iu (the equivalent of a 1.15 hours in the sun) i started feeling really much better, very noticable benefits which i would call strong general mental health improvements, mentioned them before: 

changes i experienced: much less anxiety/lots of confidence, night/day rythm returedn, no craving for sugar and hunger craving but appetite for healthy food, much less depression, much more productive/active, less emotional pain, skin colour returned, less literal tunnel vision/broader field of view, more attraction from opposite sex and people respond differently. 

i start to feel much more like i felt before hppd and the only thing i am doing different is taking these 'high dose' supplements of d3 + extra supplements. 

although i think even bteer reults can be achieved with even higher doseses, but i am gonna first do blood tests.

 

I wanted to reply to this long, because I can feel the results myself and feel people are reacting more out of gut feeling/from what they know about d3 (toxicity is dangerous), without having looked into a lot of research or experienced high dose supplementation themselves. 

dont want to attack you or anything, but you guys can come of a bit off as agressive, maybe because you are dealing with hppd and have a hard time yourself finding a cure (i know, its terrible), but then dont shoot me man, i am just trying to find what works and the researtch is promising and sharing that. i am curious what other poeple experience with hppd as well and i hope it helps them allivate problems too.

good luck with all. 

 

 

Edited January 8, 2020 by new01