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Going Anorexic!

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Planning on fasting for 5-7 days, I'm currently on day one. hoping to promote neurogenesis. Feeling like Gandhi right about now :) I'll let you guys know if i have any success.

http://www.dana.org/News/Details.aspx?id=43223

“Fasting is a challenge to the nervous system, to the energy regulating systems,” says Mattson. “And what we’re thinking, from the standpoint of evolution, is that animals living in the wild, including our ancestors, often had to go extended time periods without food. If you haven’t had food for a while, your mind becomes more active—it has to become very active, to help you figure out how to find food.”

That activity manifests itself in neuroplasticity; in mouse models, Mattson and colleagues have shown that intermittent fasting helps protect the brain from both oxidative stress and direct injury. Those protective effects result in the upregulation of brain-derived neurotrophic factor (BDNF) as well as anti-oxidants, DNA-repair enzymes, and other gene products that help promote plasticity and survival of neurons over time.

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I've never really fasted before, and this idea was totally spontaneous, so I don't really know the circuits and gears of it. From what I understand you can simply do a calorie restriction, which is to say, eat only 500 calories a day. I read somewhere that this method doesn't really do anything to the brain though. Theres also intermittent fasting, which to my knowledge is to go a day or two, and then eat for a day, and then cycle another two days of not eating, etc. I like to take things to the extreme if there's a chanc I'll get a sweet reward, and there is nothing I want more on this earth than to be hppd-free, so I'm going the full 5 or 7 days ( not to certain on which yet) on strictly water. I'm on day two, and This is counterproductive, but I smoked gratuitous amounts of ciggs yesterday, and drank coffee...sue me lol. Today I'm hoping to ween myself off ciggs so for the remainder of my fast I can go without any toxins whatsoever.

Sorry if that was hard to follow, I dreamt of instant made ramen noodles last night and I almost creamed myself...I'm really hungry haha

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this kinda happened to me over the past 2 months.. i didnt decide to do it , the combination of meds im on just removed all trace of hunger from me... at one point 3 weeks ago i went two 3 day stretches without a single bite to eat or feeling of hunger from lack of it.. dropped 20 lbs over a two week period and it's still coming off

 

 

not sure its really super healthy for me but i needed to lose the weight and not worrying about food is one less thing on my plate... sorry for the pun

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And here I thought that pun was punintended ;)

It's probably not healthy for you at all XD but hey, I know some women that would kill to lose 20 pounds that fast, I always tell them to get on the tape worm diet...for some reason they always think I'm joking. Lol, not trying to bash anyone, I could totally benefit from losing some pounds as well.

Fat jokes aside, what meds are you on? If you don't mind me asking? I'm not a strong advocate of pharmaceuticals, but if this fasting thing doesn't work I'd be willing to try some. I'm pretty sure I won't be able to hold out more than 3 days myself, I feel like I'm at fat camp and chocolate bars are the only thing that don't judge me. X)

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im taking imipramine for my ibs.. which is also an antidepressant .. lunesta and or ambien for sleep .. zyrtec once daily.. and zantac 150 twice daily for allergies .. 

 

 

the lack of appetite happened after adding the zantac to the mix. that plus the zyrtec is the only thing keeping my dermatagraphism down so it's been either i take them and dont want to rip my skin off , but i dont eat... or i dont take themand my life gets miserable.

 

so i'll not eat

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Yeah, definitely seems like the lesser of two evils. I'm on day 4 now, and I'm not even getting the slightest of hunger pains anymore, and I have more mental clarity, so there are definitely some perks to going more food abstinent, in your diet and not giving in to the vicious hunger/obesity cycle America loves to promote. I have to tell you though, I have no desire to do anything right now lol, I am so incredibly weak. I feel like this is worth it though, fasting promotes your body's natural healing processes. I truly believe your body is the best MD you'll find, and I don't care if people tell me I'm buying into some new wave hippy bullshit lol. I contacted this user on bluelight who claimed he cured his hppd by fasting. I honestly didn't know if I could trust the guy at first (I think hppd makes you more prone to not believe people), but he won me over when he replied the very next day, even though his last use of his profile was like 5 months prior. I'll post the messages he sent me, because they make more sense than any way I could explain it, and they have some science to back em up.

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Me:

Hey, not to sound like some creepy guy in an overcoat, but I've been trying to track you, or should I say a more recently active account of yours, down on the internetz. I was wondering if you are still hppd-free? I've had this bullshit for like 3 months now, and have been looking literally everywhere for a cure. You claim that you fasted for 11 days and it went away? Are the symptoms 100% gone? Like tracers, visual snow, after images, etc? I'm on day 1 of my fast, and I was also wondering how many days it took you to see improvement in your symptoms? Cus I'm really fucking hungry right now lol. I see that you haven't been active in like a year, so I really hope you reply to this. Not to sound all cliche, but you're my only hope...X)

Bluelighter:

Hey ChikitaChina.

I actually FORGOT all about my HPPD. Yes, the symptoms are 100% gone. You will notice improvement within about 3 days or so. But it comes and goes in waves, with increasing time spent "non-HPPD" and fading HPPD times. It's sort of like going into an "un-trip." Everytime you go into a trip, depending on intensity, your brain builds new connections/memories/pathways into that state of mind (or any state of mind which you go into). HPPD seems to basically be a "trip PTSD" (regardless of whether you had a difficult trip or not, the sensory experiences and patterns inevitably neurologically imprint on you). When you fast though, your brain starts reverting to a younger state of mind... Because it starts to try to remember "more and more" from the past, because it thinks that it's basically going to starve soon unless it "starts thinking" and "wakes up". Like I said, the way it seems to do this is to go "farther and farther into the past" (but with more mental strength and clarity than you had in the past). You will have vivid dreams, but each time you wake up, you'll feel more healed. Fasting is even used to cure schizophrenics (with a VERY high success rate), and people with psychological trauma. Some even experience "rebirth."

Like I said, it's no different than going into any other trip. There will be difficult moments. DO NOT ABORT THE "ANTI-TRIP". It probably is your only hope.

Me:

Thank you so much for the reply! And I'm really sorry I made you remember the dark days lol :P, I just really needed some reassurance. I'm on day two of my fast, and I feel like a starving African kid, no racism intended. I'm just super hungry! I've always tried to escape reality, it's so ironic that I'm trying to crawl my way back to it now. Haha I have one more question and then I'll let ya get on with your life, was the full 11 days necessary for you? Or did you just go a few more days for the hell of it? , whoever you are I firmly believe that you are the only person that has figured out how to cure hppd, and there are people with phd's trying to figure this shit out! Haha again, thank you soo much for the reassurance!

Bluelighter:

I would say yes, the full 11 days mattered. You lose your hunger after the 3rd or 4th day though, so it doesn't drive you nuts anymore. You just get really bored, so you just have to find other ways to occupy yourself, like walking, listening to music, reading. The hunger that you feel is called "toxic hunger" (Google it, I'm serious). It's basically like a drug addiction. You're not actually really hungry. You eat to release dopamine in your brain to stave off stress, boredom, emotional pain, etc. But everytime you release dopamine ("pleasure chemical") in your brain, whatever your current situation is, your brain thinks "life is OK, because I'm getting what I need". So if you've got HPPD AND you're eating a lot, then your current HPPD pathways at the time get reinforced. Once you stop eating, those pathways are quickly reversed, and your brain reverts to firing back up the older "more healthier/less 'effed up" pathways (basically the way you USED to think and perceive things), because during those times, it GOT the pleasure chemicals (food and stuff that kept you alive), and whatever it's doing today, it's not getting it anymore, so it starts thinking "if I don't go back to doing/feeling/thinking like I used to do, I will DIE). That's where the magic happens (the older pathways are reinforced, and the more recent unhealthier ones are torn down). Just a few days is not nearly enough time to reverse years of abuse to your brain's pathways. This eating-too-much concept is really a big reason why people just slowly degenerate and get weirder and foggier until they die/start having mental problems. Also, did you know that obesity and GI tract inflammation has a high correlation with schizophrenia???

A full 11-day fast is probably the minimum you need to shed some real neurological issues. Some people even go 20-30 days. When do you stop? You stop when TRUE HUNGER has come back. Toxic hunger is a "craving" for food as you feel now. TRUE HUNGER is different. It's undeniable when it comes, and it doesn't feel like a really bad itch that needs to be scratched (as you feel now). It literally feels like if you don't find some food, you're going to die (although you can still probably not eat for a month or two past that until you are actually at risk of dying). You HAVE to keep going until you feel the true hunger. It will be very easy to distinguish, like I said, because first you lose your toxic hunger/cravings, and then you're just not hungry at all as you go into your fast, and then all of a sudden you feel hungry again (you'll know it when you feel it).

Don't abort the "anti-trip"! You'll get restless and listless at times, but your life depends on it. You will probably feel that it's one of the most transformative and best experiences of your life once you follow through it. But sorry, 3 - 5 days isn't nearly enough!

Just... go explore nature. Spend time somewhere different. That's what helps the most. But if you're going to be doing a LOT of walking like hours a day almost every day, then your iron levels might drop, so you need to regularly eat LOW-CALORIE foods high in iron, like kale and lentils (look up vegetables high in iron). The best source of iron when fasting is all-natural beet and/or kale juice. I'm pretty sure you can find some online. I was buying a brand called Rainbow Juice (google it). So actually I did mostly water fasting, with "beet/kale juice" from Rainbow Juice on days I did a lot of walking. But you could always just sit around and find other ways to kill time.

Maybe the timeline isn't what you wanted to hear. But 11 days to save your life... may be worth it.

All I ask is that if it works for you, please spread the word to other people. In any way you can.

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I've reached day 5 of my "anti-trip".,...that word should be coined in the field of hppd, and I'm going full on Gandhi-levels of badassness and attempting to push myself to not eat for 20 days. Pray for me lol. I'm probably going to weigh as much as Gary Coleman by the end of this.

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during this spring break i will be doing a 10 day water fast, im at the breaking point with this disorder, felt so good and then it all goes down the drain. hopefully i can make it past day 4 untill the hunger stops. i dont beleive this will make my hppd go away, if anything it would have to be a 20 day one but ill try this in hopes of reduced visuals. Ill keep you guys updated

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Go for the gold Mr.50, I'm not trying to push you into doing something at a time that isn't convenient for you, but you should really try to do your water fast as soon as possible. I recommend getting your body ready for it prior to the fast though. By that I mean 2 or 3 weeks prior to fasting, eat lots of fruits and vegetables, and take as many supplements as you can get your hands on (vitamins c and b, omega 3's, the works) I'm telling you, with the medicine out today, and lack there of for hppd, I firmly believe fasting's our best bet. I'm on day 7, and I feel WAYYY better than I did. Though I feel like a shrinky-dink ( who remembers those?! Coolest shit ever, haha), weak and shriveled, I can tell that my visuals are being reduced, to the point where they do still happen, but to a much lesser extent and have very little power over me. I can dismiss tracers and afterimages easily, not creating any emotional attachment to them whatsoever. So anxiety, depression, etc. NONE of that due to visuals. To reiterate, I still see them, I just literally don't care about them. Last night I went out and looked at the stars....and for the first time in three months I didn't see static! Haha, I was so relived. I started looking at the sky harder and then noticed the static, but I've never in the 3 months I've had this shit had a second where static wasn't in the night sky. Mr.50, how bad do you want it?? I'm telling you, go the full 20 days man. It may seem impossible, but fuck it, it's gotta be done. I don't know if this fasting thing is going to cure me, and I would be ignorant if I said I had 100% faith that all my symptoms would be healed after 20 days, but it's worth a shot. I'll keep ya posted if you keep me posted man. Good luck on your fast! :)

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Also, most of the energy we get out of food goes right back into digesting more food. Abstaining from chowing down allows more energy for healing the body rather than being focused on the gullet.

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Like a salt cleanse? Lol no I would rather starve myself for a month than have massive diarrhea. Maybe I should've done a salt cleanse prior though, it probably would have sped up the healing process. I'm on day 12 and I'm still smoking damn ciggs! X( fucking nasty habit....my symptoms are dieing down slowly....and by that I mean SLOWLY. I bet if I quit the ciggs I would notice a leap in my progress...ehh idk

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It would be quite useful for you to keep a more detailed log of your symptoms and give each day a scale rating. Post it here for us if you'd like.

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Yeah that's something I should be doing, you're totally right, I've just been running on E for a while and don't really have much to say these days. BUT I'll try my best to log it out. Though I'm not too sure what you mean by scale rating, a little elaboration would be a-okay :)

-I've been feeling more like myself lately, whatever that means. I've never been too good at being in tune with myself, but I feel way more like me than I have for the past three months.

-I don't really have crazy, intrusive thoughts anymore..well, maybe one or two a day, but I've always been a little bat shit crazy ;)

-I feel more in control of myself, I.e my body, my mind. Too further explain, I use to get these images in my head while trying to sleep that would loop constantly. Not too sure if anyone can relate on that, but now-a-days, I can actually stop myself from looping these thoughts...though it takes a little effort. This Is leaps and bounds better mental control than I had.

-mental clarity is still improving

-I feel as though my visuals are slowly dissipating, I no longer think about them to great extent (more of just a , "damn! Fuck youuu after-image!") still see them. I wouldn't doubt if the visuals were e last thing to go. Floaters are still there, starbursting, tracers, the whole shebang

-I am more than likely skinnier than your dick, which I'm not too proud of. I really don't like this bulimic, tooth pick figure I've got going on, but whatever, I can always gain the pounds back.

-not as emotional as I used to be, and I use to be a psychedelic mess..well I still am, lol. But I'm mood swinging less and less these days. Not really depressed or anxious anymore, these emotions have transmuted into agitation. I'm really agitated almost constantly lol, but that should be expected when you haven't eaten for more than a week.

All-in-all I feel way better than I did. I feel more zen with my condition and shit. I'll keep ya posted! Sorry for flaking out on the progress lately! :)

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-I am more than likely skinnier than your dick

lol

Thanks for the report. By scale rating I just mean, for example, out of 10. 10 could be symptoms at their most aggressive, 0 as no symptoms. Do this everyday for each symptom (e.g anxiety / visuals / concentration / lethargy are ones I use) and afterwards it is easier to pick up on trends.

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Oh okay, sounds good. That could help me map out my own progress too. I'll start doing that tomorrow accompanied by a couple of anecdotes.

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A lot of the benefits of fasting can actually be obtained by eating MORE, as proper oxidative metabolism, and to a degree, mitochondrial uncoupling, increases autophagy/phagocytosis; this researcher noticed rodents lived longer the less they ate, but hypothesized that this was probably from a decreased toxin load. He fed another group a calorie un-restricted diet, though depleted in metals such as iron and aluminum, and they lived just as long as calorically restricted rodents. That being said, I've been having decent results with Paul Jaminet's+Dave Asprey's take on fasting. For the past few weeks I've been completing a ketogenic intermittent fast for 16-18hrs, though eating carbs and what not throughout the rest of the day, and then completing a full-on ketogenic fast for 24-36hrs 1x/week. I feel great after this. Simply restricting very specific amino acids, for instance, methionine, increases autophagy and mitochondrial biogenesis. Yet 1x/week I'm doing more than this and completely fasting outside of some medium chain fats, coffee, mineral water, and salt. 

 

When I get KetoForce (a salt of beta-hydroxybutyrate) I may try a 7-10 day fast. Fasting has been shown to cure drug resistant forms of schizophrenia, and all that is needed to maintain the results is a whole foods diet and an occasional 3-5 day fast.  

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A lot of the benefits of fasting can actually be obtained by eating MORE, as proper oxidative metabolism, and to a degree, mitochondrial uncoupling, increases autophagy/phagocytosis; this researcher noticed rodents lived longer the less they ate, but hypothesized that this was probably from a decreased toxin load. He fed another group a calorie un-restricted diet, though depleted in metals such as iron and aluminum, and they lived just as long as calorically restricted rodents. That being said, I've been having decent results with Paul Jaminet's+Dave Asprey's take on fasting. For the past few weeks I've been completing a ketogenic intermittent fast for 16-18hrs, though eating carbs and what not throughout the rest of the day, and then completing a full-on ketogenic fast for 24-36hrs 1x/week. I feel great after this. Simply restricting very specific amino acids, for instance, methionine, increases autophagy and mitochondrial biogenesis. Yet 1x/week I'm doing more than this and completely fasting outside of some medium chain fats, coffee, mineral water, and salt. 

 

When I get KetoForce (a salt of beta-hydroxybutyrate) I may try a 7-10 day fast. Fasting has been shown to cure drug resistant forms of schizophrenia, and all that is needed to maintain the results is a whole foods diet and an occasional 3-5 day fast.  

Could you recommend some reading on ketogenic diets?

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BigPapaChakra, either you're intelligent as fuck, or I'm really undereducated lol, I had to look up about half of those words XD, I live In Texas, and as you can guess, 'the good ole boys' are quite lacking in the intellectual department. I would really like to hear about the results of your ketogenic fast after you get the KetoForce. Maybe you could jot down your daily progress on here or on a separate thread, but if in fact a ketogenic fast can attribute to the same amount of healing that a water fast can, I would much rather do that. Let me know man! Seriously!!! I'm starving over here! Haha

I'll rate my symptoms later today, as I just woke up and feel the ratings would be skewed.

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Day 13: scale ratings 0-10 (0 being as close to baseline as I remember, 10 being very aggravated symptoms)

Anxiety: 3 I'm not that anxious per se, but I'm not totally zen

Visuals: 6

Concentration: 4 still a little hazy

Lethargy: 5

Memory recall: 6

I hold a very high bar for myself, so some of these ratings may be a little harsh

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