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brendan

couple of articles may be relevant: lsd, anaesthetics

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"... There's also the science of coming out of unconsciousness to consider. A new study shows it's not simply a matter of the anesthetic "wearing off."

Researchers from UCLA say the return of conscious brain activity occurs in discrete clumps, or clusters — and that the brain does not jump between all of the clusters uniformly. In fact, some of these activity patterns serve as "hubs" on the way back to consciousness.

"Recovery from anesthesia, is not simply the result of the anesthetic 'wearing off' but also of the brain finding its way back through a maze of possible activity states to those that allow conscious experience," noted researcher Andrew Hudson in a statement. "Put simply, the brain reboots itself."

Relatedly, a separate study from 2012 suggested that post-surgery confusion is the brain reverting to a more primitive evolutionary state as it goes through the "boot-up" process....." from http://io9.gizmodo.com/how-does-anesthesia-work-doctors-arent-sure-and-her-1592809615 suggests hppd may be failure to reboot.

 

".....Researchers discovered that when LSD latches onto the brain cell’s serotonin receptor, part of the receptor folds over the drug molecule like a lid, locking it in place.

“We think this lid is likely why the effects of LSD can last so long,” said Roth, who also works at the UNC Eshelman School of Pharmacy.

But, while lengthy, acid trips aren’t forever. Some LSD molecules pop off their receptors as the “lid” part moves around. And brain cells eventually respond to the drug molecule by pulling in its serotonin receptor, along with the drug, where the drug is then degraded or disassembled....." from http://www.newsobserver.com/news/local/education/article129016534.html suggests hppd may be some disruption of this mechanism, perhaps a constant recycling of the drug at the receptor?

 

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I posted a link to an article that talked about the receptor lid a few weeks back and thought perhaps HPPD is a result of that lid staying permanently shut -- but then again, why do people get HPPD from all sorts of different drugs that don't have this same effect? That's what I keep coming back to. HPPD is obtained in so many different ways through so many different types of drugs that affect so many different receptors. I just think it's strange how the symptoms of HPPD are basically those of the actual trip. As the popular aphorism goes, it's a trip that never ends. 

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20 minutes ago, K.B.Fante said:

I posted a link to an article that talked about the receptor lid a few weeks back and thought perhaps HPPD is a result of that lid staying permanently shut -- but then again, why do people get HPPD from all sorts of different drugs that don't have this same effect? That's what I keep coming back to. HPPD is obtained in so many different ways through so many different types of drugs that affect so many different receptors. I just think it's strange how the symptoms of HPPD are basically those of the actual trip. As the popular aphorism goes, it's a trip that never ends. 

Maybe its a form of memory like in PTSD. Your brain just isn't able to forget and move on from the trip for some reason.

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I also think the global workspace theory of consciousness is interesting in connection with DP-DR symptoms wherein people feel numb, like they're stuck in a dream and are generally disconnected. I'm a firm believer that we select words for a reason and that when we say we feel "disconnected" it's because we are. 

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kb fante, i missed your previous post on this.  Are you sure this lid effect does not occur with all hppd-inducing drugs? Would it not be possible that these lids are on multiple receptor types, thus explaining hppd being induced by multiple drugs? 

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5 hours ago, brendan said:

kb fante, i missed your previous post on this.  Are you sure this lid effect does not occur with all hppd-inducing drugs? Would it not be possible that these lids are on multiple receptor types, thus explaining hppd being induced by multiple drugs? 

Yeah, I thought of that too, I just don't know of any such studies that verify the existence of lids in other drugs. If so, then perhaps there could be something to it. But then again, how could this account for Visual Snow Syndrome, wherein people get the same set of symptoms without the use of drugs? And the same goes for benzodiazepine withdrawal and other neurotoxic chemicals that can induce HPPD-like symptoms. 

If I remember correctly in the recent brain imaging studies from LSD there are certain parts of the brain that become more active and others that diminish, which is part of what alters consciousness during the trip. The links above therefore make me wonder if those parts that become less active just never properly reboot, which could account for why the symptoms of HPPD so closely resemble those of the actual trip. 

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The potential for problems with the downregulations of serotonin receptors with LSD and epigenetics. I am going to need an aid to help with research compiling.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                

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